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Monday, 06 February 2012 01:00

Written by Dan Gigler

It started, as all good arguments seem to, while bellied up to a bar.

I was at a place called Knockback Nat's in Cincinnati in November when Steelers played there. The place was packed with Pittsburgh fans, which is not surprising considering that a black and gold takeover of the Queen City has become something of an annual tradition there.

Anyway, I'm waiting for my pint, standing next to a pair of Giants fans -- one from Staten Island, one from Rahway, N.J., who were in Cincinnati for an extended period for their work. We made conversation, and they casually remarked how impressed they were at the traveling Pittsburgh road show.

Talk turned to football in general, then quarterbacks and the common link of Ben Roethlisberger and the Giants' Eli Manning in the 2004 NFL Draft.

"Ben's good but we got the bettah quahtahback by fah."

That's highly debatable, I said. Admittedly, I only see Manning on the occasions that the Giants are on national TV, and while I knew he was pretty darn good, I've never been one to put him in that 'elite' category.

You'd think I just insulted their mothers.

"Bro - seriously - bro! Bro! What's Ben Roethlisbuhgah evah dunn?

Well, he's won two Super Bowls. OK, so  maybe he won one, and the other his team won almost in spite of him, but make no mistake, he got them there.

They were having none of it. That they were such New Yorker caricature-types -- think Vinnie & Ronnie from Jersey Shore but 20 years older -- and so adamant about it made it all the more hilarious.

"Bro! Bro! Big Ben did nothing in the Super Bowl except that last drive and it was against the Cardinals. Eli Manning beat the TOM BRADY AND THE GREATEST TEAM EVAH when he beat the Pats in the Supah Bowl! Bro! Bro! "

That last drive in Super Bowl XLIII was among the greatest in football history, and let's be honest - Eli Manning didn't exactly light the world on fire against the Pats; David Tyree made one of the all-time great catches and the Giants' defense was dominant in that game. I wasn't anti-Eli, just thought Ben was better.

The whole exchange was a bit amusing and I didn't really think of it again until the playoffs. Eli was simply amazing (as he was down the regular season stretch), and not just passing, but by standing in the pocket and taking a beating. And now, he's led the Giants to another Super Bowl victory, again over those same over-achieving and easy-to-loathe Patriots. Manning is elite. The New York mooks were right about that much.

But is he better than Roethlisberger?

Right now -- at this moment -- it'd be hard to say he isn't, if only by the tip of the nose of a football. Super Bowl XLVI was his finest hour (though the same was true of Big Ben after Super Bowl XLIII). They each have two Super Bowl wins. Their career stats are nearly a wash: in 7 more games played, Eli has exactly 1,000 more yards passing and 20 more touchdowns, but also 29 more picks; Ben's has 10 more rushing TDs and his rating is 10 points higher. Roethlisberger has slightly higher averages in a handful of categories and has taken 120 more sacks. 

Roethlisberger and Manning are 1-1 against each other. The two will play against each other at some point in 2012 for the rubber match (early prediction: it'll be the Thursday night season opener).

There's not a "right" answer to which is better. They're 1 and 1a. Nearly identical. And they're both just now hitting their prime - it will be exciting to watch these two over the next few years. I'm of the opinion that Roethlisberger - with those tweaks that Art Rooney spoke of - can win another Super Bowl. Maybe Manning too. Great years lie ahead for both of them.

In the mean time, its good fodder for a bar argument (as in my case) -- like Marino vs. Elway, except already with many more Super Bowl wins between Ben & Eli.

Comments (9)

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written by rog211, February 06, 2012 - 05:59 AM

Ben should have been MVP in Super Bowl 43, but he has been to three vs Manning's two. Manning however has done something that no Steeler has done, he has beaten Tom Brady and the Patriots in a meaningful game.

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written by Illinois Steeler, February 06, 2012 - 11:29 AM

I'm just glad we can have this conversation/argument. No one is talking about if Eli is better than Flacco.

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written by burt, February 06, 2012 - 12:12 PM

who cares ... the season is over and all NFL players can go back to jail, now ... except for Polamalu and Heinz Ward ... and maybe Gronkowski ... he'll be hospitalized awhile.

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written by D_Gigler, February 06, 2012 - 03:38 PM

rog211: I think in SB43 Roethlisberger was part of a split vote - you could've made a case for him, Holmes, James Harrison or maybe even Kurt Warner or Larry Fitzgerald in defeat. Conversely, Manning's MVP in SB42 was purely the result of that last drive. He did deserve it last night - and you're while you're correct about the last part - beating the Pats - but even then, Ben was a rookie and the Pats' may or may not have had a little extra video help ...

IllinoisSteeler: I don't think that will ever be a discussion, lol. Flacco is solidly second-tier, after Rodgers, Brees, Brady, healthy Peyton, Ben, Eli.

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written by Burghman28, February 06, 2012 - 07:43 PM

Anyone else picking up on ESPN stating "sources" are saying that the Steelers will hire Todd Haley as their new OC? Just like to mention that was my suggestions a few weeks ago! Think I could get a finders fee or reference bonus?

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written by steelNcali, February 06, 2012 - 07:53 PM

**s a good comparison.

off the top you think the numbers are close, which they are.

id say Ben is a better athlete, and Eli is brainer.

offensive line, play calling and fire power i would lean towards Eli having more help.

Ben has played hurt every year pretty much, Eli i dont believe would be able to produce as well with a injury.

I know who i would take! B.Roeth

SIDE NOTE ... upgrade at OC with Todd Haley. Very Nice!!!

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written by price.pittsburgh, February 07, 2012 - 02:32 AM

Eli has won 2 Conference Championships(SB Appearances) Ben has won 3.
Ben not only got us there in SB XL, he still made key plays that the team needed which his passer rating didn't represent.
He completed a 3rd and 28 yd pass for 37 yds by avoiding pressure and throwing all the way back across the field.
He had a rushing TD, another rush on a draw that set up the game clinching score on the gadget play, another run on a bootleg that prevented Seattle from getting the ball back with any reasonable amount of time, he threw the block that sprung Randel El on the gadget play and he completed a big first down on a shovel pass while being tackled.
His rating would have been much higher had Hines ward not dropped a perfectly thrown TD pass as well as two other balls.
In XLIII he was 20 of 29 for 256 yds and a perfectly placed game winning TD pass over three defenders and many other plays under pressure the stats don't indicate.
Example, how perfectly he placed the ball while rolling out on the first pass of the game for over 30 yds, how he avoided pressure and got spun around and completed a 3rd down back across the field, how on the final drive he avoided getting sacked by 3 guys to complete the first pass of the final drive, how he pump faked the DB off of Holmes and up towards Moore to free Holmes up with tons of room to run which turned a FG drive in to a game winning drive and of course how perfectly he placed the game winning TD over 3 defenders.
Forgotten was how Holmes dropped the first attempt in the end zone that was perfectly thrown and how Ben won the game even before the final drive when he was backed up in the end zone on 3rd down and threw a strike to set us up to run out the clock but the safety was called for the holding in the end zone.
In XLV Ben clearly re aggravated his broken foot when he slipped down and still brought us from 18 down to only 3 at one point.
Ben has 3 career perfect passer rated games, 2 in one season which is a record.
He is now only 1 of 12 QBs to ever pass for 500 yds in a game and 1 of only 3 to do so with at least 3 TD passes with no interceptions.
He has only been below the 90s in passer rating twice in 8 seasons and also has 2 seasons over 100.
His 8 yds per attempt is as good as it gets.
Eli came a dropped Asante Samuel int from being the goat of SB XLII and the Tyree catch was an up for grabs throw.
In SB XLVI a dropped pass from sure handed Wes Welker is what gave his shot to win again.
Don't et me wrong, I'm glad the Giants won both SBs vs NE.
I'd rater have this debate than having Brady/Belichick with a 5-0 record in SBs including one 19-0 regular season, lol

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written by price.pittsburgh, February 07, 2012 - 02:44 AM

Also, Ben won more games his first 5 seasons than any QB ever and his SB teams were 11-5, 12-4 and 12-4.
Eli's have been 10-6 and 9-7

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written by D_Gigler, February 07, 2012 - 12:32 PM

steelNcali & price: great takes guys, thanks for weighing in. And price, I think you summed it up well: "I'd rater have this debate than having Brady/Belichick with a 5-0 record in SBs including one 19-0 regular season, lol"

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